Abstraction

Feb. 4th, 2009 08:22 am
badgerbag: (Default)
[personal profile] badgerbag
http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/010999.html

What? Oh, that? No of course I'm not talking about that. It's just totally abstract.

Date: 2009-02-04 07:16 pm (UTC)
ext_28681: (Default)
From: [identity profile] akirlu.livejournal.com
So, is it possible for a PoC to be mistaken in any assessment of racism?

Is a single definition of 'racism' an objective fact that is universally agreed on?

Date: 2009-02-04 07:29 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lavendertook.livejournal.com
It's possible, but why is this the first assumption, the very first question, given that a POC minority in a majority white culture has more experience than a white person in experiencing racism? Why not extend the benefit of the doubt to POC off the bat?

And knowing how pervasive racism is (or do you disagree that racism is a pervasive problem?) do you think that POC cry foul on every possible indication of racism they see?

No, language is culturally constructed. And if you have something about the definition of racism you want to point out, please have out with it now.

Date: 2009-02-04 07:45 pm (UTC)
ext_3152: Cartoon face of badgerbag with her tongue sticking out and little lines of excitedness radiating. (Default)
From: [identity profile] badgerbag.livejournal.com
What a question! *SARCASM* No of course it's not possible for a person of color to be racist or wrong about ANYTHING!

My eyes just rolled back so far in my head I'm looking at my own ass!

Date: 2009-02-04 08:16 pm (UTC)
ext_28681: (Default)
From: [identity profile] akirlu.livejournal.com
I don't know anybody's premises for sure unless I ask -- I can only tell what they look like from here. There are lots of people who, in all seriousness, will claim that it isn't possible for a person of color to be racist, so it's not like a crazy position to infer.

Date: 2009-02-04 10:07 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ide-cyan.livejournal.com
[livejournal.com profile] lavendertook: why is it OK for white people to dismiss the pointing out of racism by the people who have greater expertise in experiencing it?

[livejournal.com profile] akirlu: So, is it possible for a PoC to be mistaken in any assessment of racism?

[livejournal.com profile] badgerbag: *SARCASM* No of course it's not possible for a person of color to be racist or wrong about ANYTHING!

[livejournal.com profile] akirlu: [strawpeople say X,] so it's not like a crazy position to infer.

All it does it make you look like a jerk for saying you're not crazy for using the possibility of POC being mistaken in an assessment of racism as a way of dissing POC's expertise on racism, which is the outrageous statement that made [livejournal.com profile] badgerbag's eyes roll back in her head.

Dismiss POC. Then reframe your argument as a position people would have to call you crazy for holding if they disagreed with you. I can only tell what your premises look like from here, and it's that you want to look like a jerk, in all seriousness.

Date: 2009-02-05 09:56 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] moondancerdrake.livejournal.com
I certainly think a POC is more experienced than a white person to decide what might or might not be racially offensive. It's like any case when you say something another person find offensive, it is far less respectful to get defensive when told you hurt another, then to take responsibility...assuming you respect that person...which I think is half the trouble. The people saying this stuff that is so obviously out of order that even my kids’ dad (who is a white man raised in a old country style Russian family) picked it up, obviously have no respect for the people they hurt or they’d not being having their pity party about hoe the mean POC are picking on them.

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